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Council of Elrond • View topic - Imprisoned RW vs. Rescuers

Imprisoned RW vs. Rescuers

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Re: Imprisoned RW vs. Rescuers

Postby miguel » Mon May 14, 2012 10:31 am

That's why we have rulings. There is no reason to change the rule (make an erratum) when I can clarify it (in the manner I just did) with a ruling.
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Re: Imprisoned RW vs. Rescuers

Postby Konrad Klar » Mon May 14, 2012 1:35 pm

If ruling would say:

"Read
all characters taken prisoner under the hazard host immediately join the company under general influence
as
all characters taken prisoner under the hazard host immediately join the company under general influence (if aplicable)"

it would be used as precedence by someone that want to play Fallen Wizard with We Have Come To Kill.
Besides requirement of playing character under GI or DI nothing prevent player from playing avatar with this card (playability of RW follower with WHCtK is under discussion AFIK).
Of course this may be arbitrary forbiddiden.

This is what I consider as good reason for errata - situation where ruling cannot be consistently applied to whole class of situations (including identical phrases).

Maybe topic becomes more complicated than it was initially espected, but rules are more buggy than it was initially espected.
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Re: Imprisoned RW vs. Rescuers

Postby miguel » Mon May 14, 2012 3:21 pm

Unfortunately for most rulings to consistenly apply to a whole class of situations, we'd need a near complete rewrite of the rules and card texts first. MeCCG is an imperfect game and we do what we can with it.

This is why the netrep team doesn't strive for rulings that cover everything, and most rulings are indeed very specific though of course trying to fit the big picture. My ruling on this matter would be worded so that it's clear when it applies, anyone using WHCtK to play an avatar based on that ruling would be laughed at (by me at least). :lol:

When we can handle something with a ruling, we should do that rather than ask/wait for an erratum.
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Re: Imprisoned RW vs. Rescuers

Postby Konrad Klar » Mon May 14, 2012 4:27 pm

With such loose conditions many possible rulings would by OK.

I see them as creative work.
I'm trying to avoid creation so much as possible. This time I have ended with conclusion that in current state rules does not allow to rescue Wizard, without breaking them.
I do not have a right to tell someone which rules should be respected, which ignored. Because it is in fact making errata to the former.
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Re: Imprisoned RW vs. Rescuers

Postby miguel » Tue May 15, 2012 9:45 am

So it seems we disagree where the fine line between rulings and errata goes. If I was to change the text in the DM rules, that would be errata. If I was to clarify that rescuing Wizards is also possible, that would be a ruling. As the netrep I do have the right to tell people which rules should be respected and which ignored, if those people wish to play under the CoE rules.

Often many possible rulings would be ok. It is our job to pick the best one. So far I haven't seen anything that actually disproves my view on RW followers taken prisoner or even shows why it would suck, so I'm inclined to go with it.
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Re: Imprisoned RW vs. Rescuers

Postby Konrad Klar » Tue May 15, 2012 11:25 am

We will not speak of such things even in the morning of the Shire.
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Re: Imprisoned RW vs. Rescuers

Postby miguel » Tue May 15, 2012 12:23 pm

But the rules on company composition limitations don't say that a RW company cannot be at the same site as a non-RW company. Only that the RW cannot be in the same company with non-RW characters outside a haven. During the org phase you may have multiple companies at a non-haven site anyway, Urlurtsu's ability is only good for bringing into play orcs/trolls that would not be normally playable there (home site). Rescuing happens in site phase, when you may not have multiple companies at a non-haven site. Or am I missing something?
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Re: Imprisoned RW vs. Rescuers

Postby Konrad Klar » Tue May 15, 2012 12:30 pm

No.
My trace is bad.
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Re: Imprisoned RW vs. Rescuers

Postby miguel » Mon May 28, 2012 9:02 am

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Re: Imprisoned RW vs. Rescuers

Postby marcos » Mon May 28, 2012 12:59 pm

sounds fine
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Re: Imprisoned RW vs. Rescuers

Postby Konrad Klar » Mon May 28, 2012 1:11 pm

Yes.
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Re: Imprisoned RW vs. Rescuers

Postby miguel » Wed Jun 12, 2013 9:54 am

Published in digest #125. Locked.
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